Humanism Has Answers - Inside Humanist Canada with Janalee Morris

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Gary joins from Guatemala, where he has been meeting with Humanistas Guatemala and learning about the growing influence of American evangelical Christianity and the fascinating tradition of Catholic-Mayan syncretism. Leon meanwhile shares updates including cautious optimism around the Hungarian election result, ongoing tensions in Iran and the Middle East, the worrying composition of the newly elected UN Committee on NGOs, and welcome news that UN High Commissioner has endorsed the codification of gender apartheid as an international crime.

This week's guest is Janalee Morris, Executive Director of Humanist Canada, which is co-hosting the 2026 World Humanist Congress in Ottawa this August. Janalee gives a wide-ranging overview of Humanist Canada's work — from training officiants and chaplains to advocacy on the census religion question, publicly funded Catholic schools, and Alberta's restrictions on gender-affirming care and medical assistance in dying. She also shares her excitement about the Congress and what it means to bring the global humanist movement together at this critical moment.

In this episode we cover

• Evangelical Christian growth in Guatemala and Catholic-Mayan syncretism
• Cautious optimism on Hungary's election result
• Endorsements for codification of gender apartheid as an international crime
• Humanist Canada Campaigns, Advocacy and Activities
• Humanist ceremonies, officiants and the provincial licensing challenge
• Why Attend The World Humanist Congress 2026

Further reading and references

• Humanist Canada: https://www.humanistcanada.ca
  • Humanist Canada chaplaincy programme: https://www.humanistcanada.ca/programs/chaplaincy/
  • Humanist Canada Choice Chat podcast on reproductive rights: https://www.humanistcanada.ca/programs/podcast/choice-chat-podcast/
• Humanistas Guatemala: https://www.facebook.com/HumanistasGuatemala
• Volker Türk supports codification of gender apartheid as a crime against humanity — OHCHR: https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2026/01/turk-urges-ambition-crimes-against-humanity-treaty

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🎶Music: Horizon by Simon Folwar

Podcast transcripts are AI-generated and may contain errors or omissions. They are provided to make our content more accessible, but should not be considered a fully accurate record of the conversation.

Transcript

Welcome to Freedom of Thought

Leon Langdon 0:05

Welcome to Freedom of Thought, a podcast for Humanist International. With me, Leon Langdon. And me, Gary McLilland. Each week we'll be discussing news, research, policy developments, and campaigns related to freedom of thought around the world. And this week we'll be interviewing the wonderful Jan Lee Morris from Humanists Canada. But before

Guatemala And Evangelical Growth

Leon Langdon 0:23

that, Gary, I believe you're still in Guatemala. How are you getting on over there?

Gary McLelland 0:27

Yes, I'm still in the wonderful Guatemala. Doing very well. I've been speaking to a range of different people, and I've been learning a little bit about Guatemala in the time I've been here. One interesting thing I've been learning about from different people is the growing influence of evangelical Christianity here in Guatemala. I guess people think of Guatemala as a Catholic country given the colonial influence, the Spanish influence. And of course, there was Mayan religions before that, which I've been learning a little bit about. And there's been a really interesting experience, which is called synchronicity, this idea of the Catholic influence being somehow modified to fit into a Mayan belief system, which I guess when we think about other experiences of colonialism, you can see often that the colonial influence is adapted to fit with existing culture and beliefs. But the growing influence of the American evangelical movement is something which I didn't really appreciate when I've been speaking to a lot of different people here about that. And opinions seem to vary, but it seems to be anywhere from 30, even up to 50% of people are choosing to identify with this American evangelical influence, which is far bigger than I had ever appreciated. So that's been quite interesting. And actually, we're recording this podcast on Monday. On Friday, I'll be in Guatemala City to meet with Humanistas Guatemala, and we're going to be showing a video, a documentary about this American evangelical influence, and then I'll be saying a few words and talking about the Congress and other work of Humanists International. So I'm really looking forward to that. And I'll have some time to spend with uh David Panida, our former board member. So yeah, it's been a really, really interesting and eye-opening experience here in Guatemala.

Syncretism And Local Religious Culture

Leon Langdon 2:18

It's interesting when you talk about synchronicity. I think obviously about the Irish context and the idea that so many, for example, Catholic festivals just got supplanted onto Irish pagan festivals in terms of time of the year to keep the changing or the sort of changing landscape as unchanging as possible, I guess, for people and to make the sort of new colonialist or just new sort of incoming dominant religion to be as easy as possible to hop on board with. But yeah, really worrying to hear about the evangelical kind of Christian movement if it's not necessarily welcomed by a lot of people. I know our Latin American members are going from strength to strength, and it's something I've heard in terms of, for example, agricultural exclaves of different communities down in the Amazon and things like that, but I hadn't really heard about the Guatemalan context before. So that's really interesting to hear, and I guess worrying.

Gary McLelland 3:04

Yeah, it is worrying. And yeah, the synchronicity thing is something that's been quite interesting to see. I mean, I'm here just now in Antigua, just outside Guatemala City, and we went in to see some churches, and a few of the things that I was struck by was statues of the Virgin Mary with very dark skin and also wearing Mayan style dresses, which was kind of interesting to see. So yeah, it's been fascinating and I guess a little bit worrying to hear some of the developments.

Hungary After Orban’s Concession

Gary McLelland 3:32

But one of the things, obviously, I've been mainly on vacation, so I've not been working that much. But one of the things I did see from yesterday was the election result from Hungary, or at least I saw I think that Orban had conceded. And I wondered what you thought of that news, Leon.

Leon Langdon 3:48

It's probably a note for I'm gonna I'm gonna say maybe cautious optimism. So yeah, it looks like Orban will be out of power, you know, pending certification and a couple more steps. And I guess the international community sort of holds its breath on that point. And there's obviously sort of decades, or not decades rather, but many years of illiberal policies and the gutting of the rule of law and the judiciary and stuff to be undone. So I I guess, you know, hopeful that he's going to be out of power. But I think between the sort of, let's say, amount of damage that's been done over the last number of years, also, of course, who we think is going to be in power next is formerly a cabinet member of Orban. So while he has, you know, spent many years distancing himself. He also, for example, didn't necessarily run on a pro-LGBTQ plus platform. Perhaps that was tactical, perhaps it was maybe not so aligned. So it is kind of a case of wait and see. I think it's been really broadly welcomed. And I think while we're probably there, maybe a bit more cautiously welcoming it on our end, a lot of hope for Hungary that I think many people didn't, myself included, didn't necessarily have before this election. So some positive noises, let's say, to say the least.

Gary McLelland 4:59

Given um some of the things I think we've discussed on this podcast, even if it's cautious optimism, that sounds like a welcome breath of fresh air, at least given how things are going.

Iran Tensions And Hopeful Restraint

Gary McLelland 5:11

Another thing I've been trying to keep tabs on whilst I'm traveling around Guatemala is the situation in Iran. I've obviously followed the peace talks in Pakistan, which seem to have failed, and I don't know what's happening in the Straits of Hormuz, but I guess any kind of thoughts on how things are developing on Iran, Leon?

Leon Langdon 5:30

I think listening should know that we filmed this podcast about a week before it goes out, and so I'm reluctant to say too much for fear that it'll be out of date. I think by the time this podcast is actually out, the sort of two-week deadline from the sort of Tuesday 8 p.m. all fire will rain down kind of deadline will have passed. So I guess we'll see what that actually leads to. I saw those sort of some sort of standoffs in the Strait of Hormouths between US warships and an Iranian Coast Guard and things like that. Let's stay optimistic, but probably with even a lot more caution there. Every day that fewer people are dying, it's probably good. But I think it's just it's difficult to see where things are going to go. And obviously, so much of this is happening behind closed doors and civil society can comment and call for things. But the ultimate truth is there's only a handful of power brokers in this whole thing that that are going to sort of determine the outcome. So I think in that sense, we're just kind of here with the rest of the world hoping that that an off-rap is found and that tensions cool and trade goes back to normal and all that, but that fundamentally people are safer and stop being killed and repressed for existing.

Gary McLelland 6:38

Yeah, definitely. Generally

UN Gender Apartheid And Alliances

Gary McLelland 6:40

thinking about our other work at the UN, our policy work, is there any other developments that have been kind of in the headlines for you, Leon?

Leon Langdon 6:48

I think one thing which was actually a couple of weeks ago, but I'm kind of only able to kind of sit with it and reflect now, is Valkyrie Turk, so the effectively the human rights chief for the UN, he's the High Commissioner for Human Rights, sort of endorsed the codification of an international crime of gender apartheid, which is something we've called for before. So under international law, gender apartheid as it currently exists is not a war crime or a crime against humanity. We've been calling for the sort of an establishment of some sort of working group or the investigation of that internationally for quite a while now. And so hopefully his calls will lead to some movement on it. Um, the other thing he called for recently or announced was this sort of founding of a global alliance for human rights, which we're hopeful will sort of reinvigorate the international human rights movement, will sort of bring together civil society and states, faith leaders, for example. Even I've seen local government being talked about, cities as sort of stakeholders in all of this, and obviously rights holders, so people themselves. I think that sort of broad-based coalition could really work. I'm always a bit skeptical with those sort of top-down approaches, the sort of announcement that this thing will exist and it will do these things. I think we'll see where it goes, but I think there's basically no one with the convening power of someone like Volker Turk in this regard. And so we're on board with this sort of global alliance. We hope to be at some meetings later in the year if they begin happening. And I'm generally hopeful that it's sort of the fire underneath the International Human Rights Committee that is really taking a lot of hits, both literally human rights defenders are struggling and being killed, but also civil society is, as we've consistently talked about, being underfunded, civil society space being undermined. So I think some sort of additional protection, additional reinvigoration of this space would be welcome. And again, greet that with cautious optimism seems to be the trend of the day.

Gary McLelland 8:42

That's very good to hear. And yeah, I think this podcast does seem like it's had a theme of cautious optimism, which I think, to be honest, um at this stage in 2026 is maybe the best we can hope for. And that's quite reassuring. But yeah, thank you so much, Leon, for those updates and for keeping on top of everything. And I look forward to seeing you next week when I'm back in London.

Leon Langdon 9:04

Thanks, Gary, excited for that as well. And I think now we can move to inviting our RN2Beon. So Janile Morris.

Gary McLelland 9:11

This

Introducing Janalee Morris

Gary McLelland 9:12

week's guest is Janile Morris, the Executive Director of Humanist Canada, which will host the 2026 World Humanist Congress in Ottawa this year. Janile started with Humanist Canada in February 2026. She has built a career as a community organizer, educator, and learning consultant with extensive experience in Canadian post-secondary education. Committed to community leadership, humanist values, and secular advocacy, Janilee has held a range of leadership roles across humanist and charitable organizations in Canada, including serving as the president of Rocky Mountain Atheists. Janilee, welcome to Freedom of Thought.

Janalee Morris 9:49

Thank you for having me.

Gary McLelland 9:52

So it's only been a few months since your appointment as the Executive Director of Humanist Canada.

Humanist Chaplaincy And Ceremonies

Gary McLelland 9:56

I guess maybe just start off and tell us how are you finding the role and what are the main issues that are coming across your desk as the Executive Director of Humanist Canada?

Janalee Morris 10:04

It's a really exciting time in Humanist Canada. We're really have entered a year of growth for the organization in sort of expanding some of our capacity to provide programming for our members. We have quite an amazing array of programs that we offer. And for a largely volunteer organization, it's really quite impressive. So some of the main things that we do are we have efficient programs. So we train people to do marriage and other ceremonies, and we're able to license those people in one of the provinces in Canada, and we're working on being able to grant that opportunity for people all across the country. So stay tuned for that. We have a chaplaincy program. So we're every year training more chaplains to take positions in places like hospitals, universities, correction centers, and also in our Canadian military. So we have one humanist chaplain officially in our Canadian Armed Forces and working on trying to expand that program. So that's very exciting. We also have a number of committees. So our Morgenthaler committee works on women's reproductive rights. And Humanist Canada was founded by Dr. Henry Morgenthaler, who was a leader in that area. So that committee does a lot of really good advocacy work and also have their own podcast called Choice Chat, which is really interesting to learn more about women's health in general and reproductive rights specifically for the last season. We have a number of educational opportunities for our members. So we do monthly webinars and we also do a lot of courses that are members and that are open to the public. So introductory courses to humanism, and we're looking at expanding the offerings for our education programming in the fall. And then we also have a number of local chapters. Canada's a pretty big country, and um, those that local engagement is really important for our members. So we have some amazing people across the country who are leading local chapters and holding events quite regularly in places all across Canada.

Leon Langdon 12:14

Thanks so much for all that, Janile. There's so much to get into.

Humanist Canada Activities & Campaigns

Leon Langdon 12:18

One thing I don't think we've really gotten into on the podcast before is sort of humanist chaplaincy. And I think there's gonna be some events later on in the year. I was wondering if we could talk about that maybe conceptually, but also, yeah, what's coming up there.

Janalee Morris 12:30

Absolutely. There are lots of spaces in institutions where chaplains are just sort of a regular part of the team of people who you might see. A good example would be in a hospital. People are regularly asked if they would like to speak to somebody, a chaplain, when they're in a time of crisis. And it is really important that humanism is also represented in that space. So we are working really, really hard to make sure that it's an option for people who are not members of a particular faith tradition to still have access to that sort of spiritual or meaningful care in those settings without having to turn to any kind of dogmatic belief system in order to get it. It's pretty common in those kinds of spaces. It's common in universities and post-secondary institutions for there to be a whole chaplaincy team. And again, really important for students to have an opportunity to speak to someone about things like their values without having to attach that to a particular religious belief system. And we have a number of people every year who go through our chaplaincy training program, and then they're attached to particular places to work as chaplains. So some of them work for Humanist Canada, some of them are embedded in institutions across the country in order to provide that kind of care for people.

Gary McLelland 13:53

One of the things we were discussing when I was in Canada a couple of weeks ago to have some meetings about the World Humanist Congress was I think the importance of these types of programs, not just for the care that it gives to people and communities, but also I was talking about my experience with Humanist Society Scotland, where I was involved in our campaigning work and our policy legislation work. And actually, one of the most amazing things was because humanist weddings have become so popular in Scotland, almost everybody in the government, everybody that you met in the civil space and so on, had been to a humanist ceremony. They knew what the humanist society was, and it gave such a sort of depth and credibility to the work that we did on the campaigning and policy side. And I do believe that we could get meetings with pretty much any senior government official because of that kind of depth of program and social work. So I guess it's it's such a really important thing, I think, generally, isn't it, to have that type of service available to people across Canada?

Janalee Morris 14:50

They're some of our biggest ambassadors for humanism. And so it's really important that our officiants and our chaplains have a clear connection to the organization and understanding of what humanism is. Every time somebody does a ceremony where they talk about humanism and how people can get more information about it, it's become a central place that we actually recruit new officiants. So somebody will attend a wedding and be, oh, I didn't realize that you could do that. That was a thing. And so people will come to our organization and say, I want to do that too. There's a real need for that. In Canada, we do face a bit of a roadblock in that marriage licensing is provincially regulated. And so we have 10 provinces and three territories, and each one of those regulates that separately and have different processes. So right now we have we're able to do that in Ontario, which is our biggest province. And we're working on being able to do that in other provinces. And, you know, that's not always an easy thing because we actually have to apply as a religious organization in order to be able to do that. So there's some technicalities that we're trying to work through in order to get equal access to our efficients as other folks who would be part of religious organizations would have.

Leon Langdon 16:03

And so, Janly,

Census Reform And Secular Policy Fights

Leon Langdon 16:04

when it comes to sort of policy issues, what kind of things are you working on beyond this? And I guess just on the provincial system, do you find that makes it a bit easier sometimes? Is government a bit closer when it comes to abacy and lobbying, or does it mean that those wins are sort of more piecemeal as you get them?

Janalee Morris 16:19

There are some things that are federal and there are lots of things that are provincial. And so it is really a sort of case-by-case basis that we take things on and try to respond to issues as they come up. One example of an national issue that we're working on right now as part of a coalition of different secular groups across the country is trying to get our census question on religion changed. So Canada does a big census every 10 years. And actually, our question on religion is used in several different other censuses that are given out in between. Our question on religion has evolved over time, but currently our position is that the question is very biased. It assumes that you are religious and asks you to identify what religion you are, even if you are not actively attending or participating in any religious activities. So it makes it a very difficult question for people to answer. So, myself, for example, if I were to answer that in the way that it's phrased, I would have to say that I'm Catholic because I was baptized Catholic. My husband would have to say that he's Jewish because that's how the question is phrased. But we're advocating for that question to be changed to remove that part about even if you're not actively participating, so that people can check no religion. And there are a number of different ways that they can do that. It does list out atheist agnostic not practicing those kinds of things. So that's a good example of a national issue that different secular groups can come together on. There are provincial issues that we also are engaged in. For example, there are three provinces in Canada that still have a fully funded Catholic school system, fully funded by taxpayer mundy. And so those are issues that those three provinces are, you know, kind of working on and trying to find ways to advocate for change there. In the province of Alberta, there have been a few quite problematic pieces of legislation that have come out in the last year. One that restricts gender-affirming care in the province, and another really recent one that restricts access to medical assistance in dying or MAID. And Humanist Canada has actually put out a position statement commenting about the issues of those and the religious influence that led the provincial government in Alberta to restrict access to those things.

Gary McLelland 18:48

And if I understand correctly, on an issue like medical assistance in dying, that's a federal mandate, a federal law which the provincial government is trying to restrict access to. So that seems like it's a problematic political situation.

Janalee Morris 19:05

It's hugely problematic. There's a deep history of what people would call a feeling of Western alienation. And that has really manifested in recent years as part of the ideological warfare that's happening, specifically in North America, that's seeped up, seeped north from what's going on in the US. And is really kind of amplified. It's been part of sort of the fabric of what it means to be a Western Canadian citizen, but it's really been amplified recently. And some of these political or policy changes that we're seeing are more based on an ideological argument as opposed to, I think, good governance.

World Humanist Congress Ottawa Preview

Leon Langdon 19:58

And I think our listeners will have heard that he was in Canada just last week to meet with you and do some site visits. How are you feeling about it? What can you let our listeners know about what's going to be in store from someone who's actually in the country as opposed to Gary and I talking about it from far away?

Janalee Morris 20:13

I can't even tell you how excited we are to be hosting, hosting the world on our doorstep in Ottawa in our in our nation's capital. Gary and I have been working really hard on putting together an amazing conference for everyone who's going to attend. Canadians are some of the nicest, most welcoming people you will meet. And we have a whole team of people putting together all of those welcoming activities to make sure that everyone has just an amazing time here in Canada. The program is shaping up. I think there'll be some big announcements in the next week or two about some of our speakers that we've been able to confirm. And, you know, we also have a lot of opportunities for people to just tell their stories and get to know each other. We're really hoping that this is an opportunity for people to get to know what's going on in Canada in the humanist movement and also to learn from one another about what is happening around the world for humanism. It's a really important time, I think, for humanism. We see what's going on all around the world. And humanism has some answers, I think, has a role to play in trying to right the ship. I think. Humanism was one of the founding principles for things like the creation of the United Nations. And we're seeing those things threatened, and then we're seeing the results of those things being threatened in what's going on in the world. And I think we have a moment now to come together globally to say these are the values that we hold. And these are the values we think that we share with the vast majority of people around the world. And we want to come together and have a voice to say to those people in power this is how we want our world to look. This is, these are the rules we want to live by. And I think that's going to be the opportunity that we have.

Gary McLelland 22:05

I should say I'm I'm also very excited, having been working with you, Janile, on on the program and our listeners will be excited to know that the speaker program is about to be announced imminently. And we've got some really engaging speakers on a whole range of different topics. But I think most exciting is that, Janile, you've been working on a really important sort of cultural program, social program to help people engage with Canadian culture and feel really welcomed and inspired and get a real sense and perhaps taste of Canadian culture, which is very, very exciting.

Janalee Morris 22:37

Yeah, we're super excited to share a lot of our culture, arts and culture with the world. So we'll have some of our indigenous Canadians coming to welcome people from around the world. We'll have some francophone components to some of the arts and culture, lots of music, because that is a really important part of any culture, really. And then hopefully we'll have some tasty tidbits for people to partake in.

Why This Congress Matters

Leon Langdon 23:11

But also just really exciting. You know, we've consistently talked with guests across this season of the importance of just coming together in in times of strife, difficulty, turbulence, even if you want to take a lighter turn on it. And I think something like the World Humanist Congress is just a really perfect opportunity to come and share stories of resistance and resilience from around the world to strategize, to talk about the things that are challenging to us all. Because as you mentioned, for example, in the sort of North American continent, sort of Christian nationalism and different things seeping across the your southern border, as you put it. We're seeing that sort of contagion across the world between these different issues. And I think to come together and share stories and strategies is hugely important.

Janalee Morris 23:56

Agreed. Yeah, the time to act is now. One of the things that I've been reflecting on is this phrase, not on my watch. This is my watch. This is our watch, right? And so now we need to step up. We really need to uh raise our voices.

Gary McLelland 24:12

Thank you so much, Jennifer. And then I guess I mean, just to reaffirm um everything you've said there, Mary, is it's been my immense pleasure and privilege to spend a few days and a few different trips in Canada to meet with yourself and your team and just the excellent people that Humanist Canada has all across Canada and to get to meet some of those guys and for our listeners and our members, I really say like this is not one to miss. Make sure that you've got your ticket, get yourself booked, and you're going to meet some really amazing people. It's going to be a really fun and inspiring Congress. So, yeah, thanks so much for your time, Janile. I guess we've just got a few more minutes left. But is there any message or anything that you'd like to share with the members of Humanist International around the world, or any last thoughts from you?

Janalee Morris 24:57

It really is a privilege to be part of Humanist International. This organization does great work all around the world. We recognize in Canada that our issues are, I guess what we would say first world issues, right? Like we were talking about higher-level policy issues that where in in some places people are struggling just to survive, or blasphemy laws making people do jail time for just for speaking out. And so I think these kinds of partnerships are also really reaffirming of our humanist values. So, you know, we all in in our home countries, we all have our issues and our battles that we're fighting, but to come together globally and really understand that we all have we're in different places and we can support one another and we can maybe set examples where we have maybe more resources to be able to do that. It really is a privilege to be part of an organization like this that works around the world to do these really positive things. So thank you. And Gary, it's been an absolute pleasure to be organizing the conference with you. We're so excited.

Gary McLelland 26:04

Thank you so much, Shannon Lee. And we'll see you in August.

Janalee Morris 26:07

See you in August.

Listener Questions And Closing Requests

Leon Langdon 26:08

If you found this episode useful, please share it with others. Subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts, and leave us a rating and five-star review. It makes a big difference in helping new listeners find the show. If there's a topic you'd like us to cover or someone you'd like to suggest as a guest, you can contact us via the links in the show notes. And next week's episode, which will be the last of the season, will be Gary and I answering your questions. So please get those in the next couple of days. To find out more about the work we do or to join Humanist International, visit humanists. Thank you to our producer James and the team at Humanize Live and to the team at Humanist International. Thank you for listening to this episode of Freedom of Cop.